So Sad It's Almost Funny

An actual email exchange, in chronological order. Emphasis in bold added for punctuation/comic effect.

On Dec 24, 2009, at 7:22 PM, scott wrote:

hello matt
this is scott from [some metal band]
could we do a metal version of this and put it on out new cd? we arent signed and all that jazz and would give ytou full credit for the song and all and even link it to you inside the cd jacket or anything else we could do? hit me back man please!!!

So far we’ve got three things:

  1. They want to use one of my songs (that they didn’t name) on an album, presumably something to sell at shows and online.
  2. They are not signed to a label.
  3. Scott can not spell, punctuate, or capitalize.

It’s all good, though. Read on for my reply:

From: Matthew Ebel
Sent: Wed, December 30, 2009 10:48:57 AM

Scott-

Greetings from Boston! First of all… I’m not sure what song you’re asking about, you didn’t mention any in your email. Second, if you’re planning on selling CD’s, you will need to actually license tunes that you want to cover. I know you’re not signed to a label, but neither am I! If this business is going to survive without major (annoying) record companies, independent guys like us have to do our business right. I am honored that you want to cover one of my tunes, though, let me know what you have in mind!

Pax,
Matthew

On to some clarification:

On Dec 30, 2009, at 12:17 PM, Scott wrote:

matt

it was the ninja song …no label dont like them either huh? well maybe you can help us out what are some of the biggest steps you have done to help yourself? you talk about licensed stuff i take u are ascap or bmi? hit me back theres things i need to know!

ian

Wait, now his name’s Ian? Alright.

Still, not bad… sounds like another independent guy like me just starting out. Anyone who’s followed me for more than a week knows I’m all about spreading the things I’ve learned with those who are new. I’m also all about making sure independent musicians run our businesses correctly.

From: Matthew Ebel
Sent: Thu, January 7, 2010 11:13:31 AM

Ian-

It’s not that I don’t want a label, just that most label contracts aren’t good business for the artist. If you’re looking for career advice, though, the best thing I could suggest is to follow a few indie music leaders like the folks at Music Think Tank, Derek Sivers, and Jonathan Coulton. You can also follow MY exploits at http://matthewebel.com

As for licensing, I am registered with BMI, but that’s for performance royalties. For releasing cover recordings on an album you’d typically go through the Harry Fox Agency, which doesn’t represent indie bands to my knowledge. Their rates are pretty much the industry standard, though, 9.1¢ per track per unit sold. So say if you wanted to cover one song and have 1,000 albums pressed, it’d be a licensing fee of $0.091 x 1,000 = $91. Of course, you also have to factor in online sales and streams as “units sold”, so there’s a bit of accounting involved.

hence why I haven’t released a cover tune on my albums yet. ;)

Pax,
Matthew

Basic business, right? This kind of basic licensing is something I had to learn, in this case it’s honestly not expensive at all. Remember, we already established that Scott wants to release this on an album, right? So here’s the punchline:

On Jan 7, 2010, at 2:39 PM, Scott Doyle wrote:

matt

no bigge man and thanx for the advice honestly

BUT

we were just gonna use the song to mess with people as we are a heavy metal… i heard the song off of my teachers you tube account..

i thought maybe you would get a kick out of hearing a metal version of it dude its not like we would use the song as a major “selling” point anyway you now?

No, no I don’t “now”, he said he wanted to put it on an album. And he’s a student? God, I hope he’s younger than high school age with the way he writes…

jeez if a joke cover tune made us hit i would quit anyway ,, honestly…i kid you not…its not like we are hurting for ideas…i actually have a song up on myspace called counter terror tactics thats our little homage to the arts metal style…

but as far as the ninja song its a great tune actually for what it is but for what we were useing it for would have been more as a tripped out joke version..not a “hit”

Gee, thanks.

usually people would be flattered to have a metal band do a cover but we are just a metal band on a small label and aint looking to make tons of money anyway..

…and now he’s on a label? Did he get signed during the course of this exchange? Damn, I must re-think my career plans. Anyway, here’s where it gets weird…

good luck w/ the whole indie thing …some people are just to stuck on themselves in the “indie” scene thinking they are some type of elitetists these days man honestly…thats my 2 bits…theres as many problems with one as the other …

i think maybe we got off on the wrong foot or something cause you come off as alittle arrogant.. i mean honestly you have to understand i care about your genre of music and think the same of it as you do of ours, you prolly think we are are long haired freaks as much as we think you are a church going choir boy geek

Stop, stop, the flattery is killing me.

but see since i didnt take that attitude and took a more relaxed attitude and actually was cool and asked to play your song… hell most of these punk kids play stuff that live and dont even ask…i was trying to be a better person…

I’m assuming at this point he means people are playing stuff “live” (not songs that live, that sounds like a science experiment gone wrong). Of course, you never need to ask to play covers live, only to broadcast the recordings. But he wasn’t asking about that, remember?

but then again maybe i misread this whole thing and im the prick…who cares this all bs anyway..apologize for trying to be cool… but i will say this …this is the first time i ever talked to a “indie” guy as cocky over his music as this usaully indie guys are willing to do stuff on comp just to get there stuff out there to different audiences…maybe thats all thats has struck me as wierd..only reason i asked about how to go about doing this the right way was i thought that was the problem but i see its not…what you afraid we gonna do your song better or something

I listened to their MySpace samples. Trust me, that thought was not keeping me up at night.

i bet you either are a schooled player, teacher or have a degree in music dont ya?? hahahahaha…..toooo funnnnyyyy!!!

Two out of thee ain’t bad, as though that somehow made me less legit a musician, right?

you dam are as square as a person i have ever came across….good god i thought some fo these labels owners were wierd!!!!

i call it like i see man…have a good one…

good bye from the evil metal long hair azzholes ;) muwahahahahha….jeez.

and what the hell is pax? no no please dont respond please…i dont wanna be infected by any more of this lameness.

OK, I get asked that last question a lot. Here’s what “Pax” means: http://tinyurl.com/ylsfa5a

As for the rest of it… wow. I mean, this kid’s got a bright future. I wish you and [some metal band] only the best, Mr. Scott and Mr. Ian. Try not to get sued when you start selling cover tunes you didn’t pay for. And pay attention in English class, please, this was harder to follow than John Freeman

P.S.: If you liked what you read, please share it with others!

  • http://www.cc-chapman.com cc_chapman

    Uhh..hmmm….I don't even know what to say….

  • SilverAutomatic

    I just… I… but… wow…

    Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the No Child Left Behind act at it's very best.

    And where did they get cocky? I lol'd at that.

  • http://nelsonv.blogspot.com/ Nelson V

    In my opinion, the steady decline of proper spoken and written English has declined exponentially with the increased use of the internet. It's really sad when you can't write your way out of paper bag.

    Regarding Scott & Ian, they're young ones. Feelings got hurt no matter how professional you tried to be. Under the right circumstances, I am sure you would've allowed someone to license your music… *under the right circumstances*. I would agree this scenario doesn't qualify. They have a bit to learn about professionalism and I think that'll come with age and experience (and hopefully a lot of mentoring).

  • http://www.cc-chapman.com/ C.C. Chapman

    Uhh..hmmm….I don’t even know what to say….

  • jh

    Translation:

    Can we steal your work and not pay you for it? Because saying your name is good enough and you should be grateful that we’re giving you the free advertising.

    We might make money on it, but hey, you should be happy we’re taking food out of your mouth.

    ———–

    Argh. As I said on twitter.. it amazes me the amount of people who would steal from you, and then blame you for not being grateful for the free marketing you’re getting. I see it in my writing, and in artwork, and in music

  • Anonymous

    I just… I… but… wow…

    Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the No Child Left Behind act at it’s very best.

    And where did they get cocky? I lol’d at that.

  • Anonymous

    I just… I… but… wow…

    Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the No Child Left Behind act at it’s very best.

    And where did they get cocky? I lol’d at that.

  • bonniegodbee

    Wow! I've spent a good part of today arguing with people about “stealing” music and movies. I've argued about using the works of other people to make a profit without their permission. I feel I'm arguing with a brick wall. Very third grade of Mr ScottIan to immediately attack you when he/they doesn't get his/their way. Wait, I think I just insulted my third grader.
    I cry when I think of our future, or maybe I don't cry, I scream.

    n e w@y u (hur(h g0in ch01r boY cokkieee geek, I still <3 u
    (that took way too long for me to type)

  • http://nelsonv.blogspot.com/ Nelson V

    In my opinion, the steady decline of proper spoken and written English has declined exponentially with the increased use of the internet. It’s really sad when you can’t write your way out of paper bag.

    Regarding Scott & Ian, they’re young ones. Feelings got hurt no matter how professional you tried to be. Under the right circumstances, I am sure you would’ve allowed someone to license your music… *under the right circumstances*. I would agree this scenario doesn’t qualify. They have a bit to learn about professionalism and I think that’ll come with age and experience (and hopefully a lot of mentoring).

  • http://nelsonv.blogspot.com/ Nelson V

    In my opinion, the steady decline of proper spoken and written English has declined exponentially with the increased use of the internet. It’s really sad when you can’t write your way out of paper bag.

    Regarding Scott & Ian, they’re young ones. Feelings got hurt no matter how professional you tried to be. Under the right circumstances, I am sure you would’ve allowed someone to license your music… *under the right circumstances*. I would agree this scenario doesn’t qualify. They have a bit to learn about professionalism and I think that’ll come with age and experience (and hopefully a lot of mentoring).

  • Anonymous

    Wow! I’ve spent a good part of today arguing with people about “stealing” music and movies. I’ve argued about using the works of other people to make a profit without their permission. I feel I’m arguing with a brick wall. Very third grade of Mr ScottIan to immediately attack you when he/they doesn’t get his/their way. Wait, I think I just insulted my third grader.
    I cry when I think of our future, or maybe I don’t cry, I scream.

    n e w@y u (hur(h g0in ch01r boY cokkieee geek, I still <3 u
    (that took way too long for me to type)

  • MarjorieM

    For fans who want to record your music, they sure have an odd way of convincing you that it would be a good idea! I agree with the other comments about how young these guys must be. Sounds like they have a lot to learn about conducting the business side of things in an appropriate manner. (For a time, I actually wondered if it was someone masquerading as a starting-out metal band, who was hoping to get your permission to record the song for free, and who would then use it for a TV ad or on a CD destined to sell many more than 1000 copies.) I think you did your best to be reasonable with these guys. I love the “pax” link, by the way!

  • NinTheFolf

    Haha…wow…just, just wow.

    I remember back in elementary school we were taught how to accept no for an answer, maybe this guy and his band are still in preschool and that's why he didn't know? ;P

    But seriously, this is just kinda pathetic. He's asking you to use something you own, but doing so in a very unprofessional way (as you pointed out). You think if he really cared, he could /at least/ take the two seconds to run a spell check. It's not that hard, my 10 year old sister knows how to do it |:

  • MarjorieM

    For fans who want to record your music, they sure have an odd way of convincing you that it would be a good idea! I agree with the other comments about how young these guys must be. Sounds like they have a lot to learn about conducting the business side of things in an appropriate manner. (For a time, I actually wondered if it was someone masquerading as a starting-out metal band, who was hoping to get your permission to record the song for free, and who would then use it for a TV ad or on a CD destined to sell many more than 1000 copies.) I think you did your best to be reasonable with these guys. I love the “pax” link, by the way!

  • Anonymous

    Haha…wow…just, just wow.

    I remember back in elementary school we were taught how to accept no for an answer, maybe this guy and his band are still in preschool and that’s why he didn’t know? ;P

    But seriously, this is just kinda pathetic. He’s asking you to use something you own, but doing so in a very unprofessional way (as you pointed out). You think if he really cared, he could /at least/ take the two seconds to run a spell check. It’s not that hard, my 10 year old sister knows how to do it |:

  • Lisa2010

    This discourse was absolutely hilarious…but that's easy for me to say, since I wasn't the one getting pulled into a growing spiral of obtuseness. The guy's touchiness is a little sad, but the kid is probably too young and inexperienced to realize that “indie” does not equal “unprofessional.” If he ever has to support himself with his music, he may find himself also taking up these “cocky” business practices.

    On a side note… I thought the “choirboy geek” label was kinda cute.

  • Anonymous

    This discourse was absolutely hilarious…but that’s easy for me to say, since I wasn’t the one getting pulled into a growing spiral of obtuseness. The guy’s touchiness is a little sad, but the kid is probably too young and inexperienced to realize that “indie” does not equal “unprofessional.” If he ever has to support himself with his music, he may find himself also taking up these “cocky” business practices.

    On a side note… I thought the “choirboy geek” label was kinda cute.

  • Anonymous

    This discourse was absolutely hilarious…but that’s easy for me to say, since I wasn’t the one getting pulled into a growing spiral of obtuseness. The guy’s touchiness is a little sad, but the kid is probably too young and inexperienced to realize that “indie” does not equal “unprofessional.” If he ever has to support himself with his music, he may find himself also taking up these “cocky” business practices.

    On a side note… I thought the “choirboy geek” label was kinda cute.

  • Lisa2010

    This discourse was absolutely hilarious…but that's easy for me to say, since I wasn't the one getting pulled into a growing spiral of obtuseness. The guy's touchiness is a little sad, but the kid is probably too young and inexperienced to realize that “indie” does not equal “unprofessional.” If he ever has to support himself with his music, he may find himself also taking up these “cocky” business practices.

    On a side note… I thought the “choirboy geek” label was kinda cute.